Dub & Tre Podcast
Our goal is to influence men and women to build stronger relationships, become better friends, parents, companions, life partners, and financially, physically and mentally healthy. Guest co-hosts inform you on financial literacy, health, wellness, relationships and many other social topics that we hope lead to self-reflection and motivation to improve our unique lives. Good Leaders are Great Followers ! And it will definitely be entertaining !!
Dub & Tre Podcast
Episode 34: Love & Hate - Miss T.T
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During this episode of the Love & Hate series, Dub & Tre sit down with Miss T.T to continue their explorartion into different experiences in relationships. Listen in to get this Southern Bells perspective on Dating, Income, and Gender roles in a relationship.
we have another wonderful guest. We would like to introduce tt to the podcast, so tell us a little bit about yourself. Say hello, tt hello everyone.
Speaker 2:my name, everyone. My name is Titi. I'm an original native from Georgia. I'm here in Maryland, glad to be on the show.
Speaker 1:Good to have you, good to have you. We definitely like to get a different perspective on the show. You know everybody can be like minded, like Dub and Trey, so we want to definitely have some different voices and some different perspectives. So let's jump right into it. Titi, I got a question for you. When you hear a relationship is 50-50, what does that mean to you? Do you believe in 50-50 relationships?
Speaker 2:Oh, that's a good question. When I hear that a relationship is 50-50, what I hear is that neither party is sort of giving their all. Now I do understand that there will be times like when maybe the male needs to show up more than the female and vice versa, but I do think the goal should be that everybody's trying to give at least 100. So I personally don't believe in the 50-50.
Speaker 1:Okay. That's interesting, that's interesting.
Speaker 3:Why do you think a lot of men are pushing that narrative about going 50-50? Because I feel like men are kind of saying that more than women. You know what I'm saying. So why do you think men are screaming that 50-50 a little bit more than probably in the past? And the second part of that question is do you think that women who don't believe in 50-50 think on the same lines as you do about it being 100-100 versus 50-50?
Speaker 2:Gotcha. Well, I can start off by saying I'm pretty sure a lot of women don't agree with my viewpoint. That's kind of why I started off with off by saying I'm pretty sure a lot of women don't agree with my viewpoint. That's kind of why I started off with the introduction like I'm from the South.
Speaker 2:So you know I'm a little bit more traditional than a lot of women, but I think that you know, men, some men are starting to be, you know, more proponents of the 50-50, just because a lot of women are now wanting more authority, I'll say, in the relationship. You know, they're wanting to have more of a voice, they're wanting to, you know, get out and make their own money or have their own businesses or streams of income. And so you're, in my opinion, you're starting to see more masculine type women or women that are having more of that masculine energy, and so, for that reason, that's why I think that a lot of men are like all right, well, if you're trying to be on my level within this, going to be 50, 50, then I'm not doing the most and you know you want to be on the same level that I'm on. Again, that's just my opinion, right.
Speaker 1:Right, if you want to dominate, if you want to dominate certain things, then you should be contributing as if you're in that same energy, in that same space, right? I mean, that's how a lot of men think.
Speaker 3:yeah, I would definitely does 50 50 move past financial pieces? Because I feel like sometimes when we talk about that 50 50, it gets woven into different pieces of relationships, sort of when it benefits the person who's bringing it up. You know what I'm saying. So initially, for me, when I think 50-50, when I hear someone say that I'm thinking financially 50-50. I do have, you do have, we both bring our financial pieces together and we sort of do our thing that way where you're responsible for half of whatever we have and I'm responsible for what? Half of whatever we have.
Speaker 3:But I feel like relationships in general have always been kind of 50 50. When it came to decision making, Like in my experiences I don't know, you know you could obviously agree or disagree with this, and my experience is with my parents and people I know when it comes comes to decision-making and things like that, that's always sort of been a 50-50 thing. I don't know many men in relationships who respect their women that just make decisions without her input or her say-so in it and they may not call that 50-50, but I feel like that's always existed in some way shape or form outside of the financial piece.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I can agree with that. I definitely think that when it comes to any sort of decision, just like with any relationship, that that should be like a partnership. So there is a conversation that both parties should have. But I do believe, if you know, if there's a situation where we need to sort of if we're at opposite ends of the spectrum, I do think then it should be. Then the male whatever 50, 50 or you would be more traditional with a man is typically the provider when it comes to the finances.
Speaker 2:I would say, growing up, like you know, like my, my brothers, my father, my grandfather, they always took care of like their women, like that's what I've seen. But me personally I can say from my experience I like to be someone that also sort of contributes. So it doesn't appear as if not necessarily that you're taking like your, you know your spouse for granted. But I just, I don't know, I just feel like it's also the female's responsibility to sort of pull her weight. Um, so yeah, that's, that's that's what I think.
Speaker 1:Okay, and that, who, who, who influenced you most when it comes to the men and women role in a relationship? Who do you think influenced you the most?
Speaker 2:Um, definitely my grandparents and, um, my brothers. Honestly, um, my grandparents, before they passed, like they've been married for 50 years and during that time, like my grandfather basically just took care of my grandmother, you know she basically handled all the domestic things or whatever, but she'd always, you know, say to you know, find you a good man, whatever, whatever, but always have your own. So you sort of have something to fall back on. And then again, seeing my brothers and you know, being the only female and growing up with like brothers and male cousins or whatever they always talk about. You know, it's a man's responsibility to take care of a, you know, of their woman, but they also want to see that, you know, if something happened, um, that they felt like the woman also could have their back. So, um, I would say that's who influenced me the most.
Speaker 2:And then just you know, I just think I don't want to say like you sort of um, expect for the worst to happen, but I do feel, like you know you should, you should sort of have you like some sort of backup plan. Like I hate to be in a situation where you know the relationship didn't work or the marriage didn't work, whatever it is, and then you know, like you see that a lot of times, like on reality shows, where you see these women, that now, after the man leaves, it's like they have nothing you know. So they're fighting hard for child support or alimony or whatever, because they didn't have their own sort of income. Or I don't want to say a backup plan, but just some other way to sort of, you know, provide for themselves.
Speaker 1:So yeah, it's uh. It's interesting that concept when, when you're in something, that expectation is very high for it could be very high for a woman If that's her thing, she wants a man to take care of everything but when, if that dynamic changes, then you know, like you said, you should have a backup plan and be preparing uh things, you know, putting things away financially, educating yourself, having a career, having different goals, those type of things. But if you're solely relying on a man who has flaws, who can change his mind, who can lie, who can wake up and say, hey, I don't want to do this anymore, you are essentially putting, putting someone else's decision-making in front of your own. And then there's a you know, and then there's an expectation or consequence that somebody has to pay for that after the fact, and typically it's the man. But again, um, that's a good point. That's interesting, I guess, for me when it comes to um again.
Speaker 3:Um, that's a good point. That's interesting, I guess, for me. When it comes to um, which is just a little too bold a backup plan and I agree people should have some type of backup plan right but somewhere in that space I believe that an immature person could uses that backup plan as a means of like I, I'm only going to try this hard because I know that I can leave and be okay Versus when you don't have that or you're working on that backup plan. And I'm not saying it is good to be forced to stay in a relationship. That's a bad relationship.
Speaker 3:But the reality is, is that when you're with somebody long enough you're going to have bad times? It doesn't necessarily mean you're in a bad relationship. It just means you're going through a bad moment or a bad time, regardless of what that is Right, whether y'all are not communicating well or the physical part might not be there. But anyone who's been in any type of long term relationship knows that things are up and down Right. The down part doesn't necessarily mean you're in a bad relationship. But there's a piece of me that believes that when people have that nest egg where they can step away, that the immature minded person would choose to do that, like I'm not going through this, I shouldn't have to do this. It's been two months since XYZ, or three months or four months or whatever it is, and they choose to just leave versus sticking it out and not dealing with the downside of those relationships. You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. I love the fact that you said though that would be an immature person, because you know it goes back to what is the motive of why you're setting that you know, quote unquote nest egg, and it shouldn't be. This is my escape plan. You know what I mean it should be. You know, again, this is the backup. You know what I mean. Like I would hate to think that. You know, my partner and my spouse, whatever, if we come across hard times, you know, and having to, you know I'm not a man, but, again, having so many men in my life that talk about the different struggles that you guys go through, you know, trying to live up to being quote unquote a real man, so I would hate to think that if they went through something, then now they have that additional pressure of you know, how am I going to provide for my family? Is my woman going to look at me differently? You know, because I'm not bringing in as much or whatever's going on.
Speaker 2:You know I would like to think that you know whoever you know the woman is, would be like you know what baby, I got you for a couple of months.
Speaker 2:I, you know, I had this saved up, or let's pull from what I got. You know what I'm saying? Like that again, that goes back to why I think it should be 100, 100, you know, we're both, you know, putting in the same effort. If we both have like sort of the same long-term goals, then we're both working for the same thing. Maybe right now, as the man, you want to just pay all the bills, and that's fine, but that doesn't mean that I'm not still going to be making sure that we got savings. Or, you know, this is our travel money, I don't know, but you know what I mean.
Speaker 3:That's that's why I say again it has to be 100, 100, not that 50, 50. Yeah, and sticking to, like the 50 50. I know we kind of moved away from it, but there was another piece of it that, um, I found that that the 50 50 thing also seems to sometimes reflect for women and obviously correct me if I'm wrong reflect for women, like this self-independence. That's different when, when you say it's 50 50 or we're equal, which is fine, and I'm trying to ask the question the right way, I guess I'm asking do you think that when women who believe in that 50 50 piece, do you believe that they bring an independence to their relationship that they're trying to protect, believe that they bring an independence to their relationship that they're trying to protect, and because they're trying to protect?
Speaker 2:that independence, that that is where that 50-50 piece comes from. You know, I really can't answer that. To be honest, I think that, as far as you know independence is concerned, I think it's important for each person not to lose themselves. So you know, and then that keeps you from being really too attached, right to the point where you're clingy and it's unhealthy. But I do think it's important for each person to sort of have their own, you know, hobbies or, again, income, whatever it is. And so as long as you continue to maintain, I guess, your identity while you're still sort of pouring into the relationship or the marriage or whatever it is, then I think that's fine. It shouldn't be a. You know, I have to protect, so to speak, my independence because I'm losing something by being with you. It should be, you know.
Speaker 2:Obviously I feel like with all relationships there's going to be some sort of compromise and that's on both sides. So maybe it is. You know, I'm a girly girl. So I like you know doors being open for me. I like you know, I like to cuddle and things like that, you know. So in exchange for that, I'm going to bring my masculine energy down. You know what I mean. I'm going to be feminine because I want to feel like a woman. I want to. I want to feel like a woman. I want to. I want to feel like a man is strong and protected me. You know what I'm saying. So I do feel like you know. With, with relationships again, um, there there is some, some compromise, or there is a little bit of give and take, but it shouldn't be in order for me to maintain my independence, so to speak. You know, it can only be 50, 50,. I'm only going to give so much, you know. So if it doesn't work out, then you know I'm still good If you get what.
Speaker 1:I'm saying While you were talking I just thought about, wow, I don't recall people actually having these type of conversations or talking about that expectation at the beginning of a of a relationship or when you start dating somebody, what those expectations look like when it comes to where you see yourself if you were to get into a serious relationship. You know, hey, I'm good with this 50 50 thing, or I expect a man. A lot of these things are never really talked about until there's a problem. So it's just interesting that is not contributing what the other person thinks they should be contributing in some shape, form or fashion. And then you know it's already kind of too late because you already invested into this situation, you already care about this person. So I just wanted to get your take on. Do you think these conversations are had from a woman's perspective? Do you think women are really truly having these conversations with men, or are they really just having them with themselves?
Speaker 2:So I think that's why a lot of people talk about you know, when you first get with someone, you meet the representative. You know what I mean. Like they show you what they think you want to see or they don't want to bring up certain things because they think you know it's going to scare the man away because we're being too serious or whatever. That again you want to see if you're on the same page with someone, like you said, hopefully before. You know now feelings are involved and then you know you get to the point where you feel like you're settling. You know because had you known in the beginning, maybe the relationship wouldn't have gone as far as it did. You know because obviously you don't see, you know you're not seeing eye to eye certain things. But yeah, I just again, I hope these are conversations that people have early on. I think I can understand why people wouldn't, to be honest. But then I do feel like, even if you're not having a conversation, sometimes your interactions with people can show you the type of person they are Like.
Speaker 2:If you always go out and like the female is always sitting back, like you know, I'm just going to wait for him to pay, you know, and she never do anything. You know what I mean. She's kind of telling you without telling you. I expect for the man to do everything. You know I'm not looking for. You know I don't expect to have to give to you because you're a man or you know, quite honestly, some females use men. You know, I just want the free meal or whatever it may be.
Speaker 1:But yeah, hopefully the conversation is had, but if it's not, then hopefully pay attention to the signs.
Speaker 2:Yes, absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 3:But what do you think? I think that's a hard conversation to have when you first meet somebody because, speaking about myself and looking back on all the relationships I've been in and looking back on all the relationships I've been in, I did not know that I would have to adjust certain things about myself with each of those people to keep the relationship in a certain place, like you're always the authentic you. But until you really know the person you're with, you don't know what changes you may have to make or things you may have to consider or check. You know a man doesn't know what areas or spaces he may have to soften, or what areas or spaces that he did not understand, that she needs something more from him in that particular space that maybe his previous partners didn't need. You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 3:So, like for like for you, tc, you were saying how you like to cuddle when you're a girly girl, with that man has never had a woman like you.
Speaker 3:That might not have been something that he's ever really had to pay attention to and help foster in that relationship Right?
Speaker 3:So and I'm not saying that's not even a conversation you would have a front, but it's hard to tell a person like what you're willing to bend or willing to um, to change for them, when you don't know yet if they're worth those changes or worth those those things for you to adjust to. So, yeah, I think for me it is hard to tell someone that I'm just meeting, these are my standards, this is how I am, and make it sound like absolutely that's what it is, because the fact is is that once we start rocking with each other and if you're the person that I need you to be, all those standards might go out the door I will end up ending and and turning things so that we work, and that doesn't doesn't necessarily mean that I'm always who I was when we first met. So you know what I'm saying. So for me, yes, the conversation should happen, but there's so many things that happen once you get to know someone that you don't know yet.
Speaker 1:Right, right, I would say when I posed the question it was really more so for women, because most women already have that thought process in their head on what they expect. I would agree with you 100% that men don't really know yet because they don't know who this person is. They don't know. It's the same concept of you meeting someone and a woman saying I want to be a wife and a man not looking at that concept in that way because he doesn't know if he's going to even fall in love with a woman to be his wife. The woman has already have this. The woman will already and, tt, you can correct me if I'm wrong or you can disagree, but I feel that a woman will will be so forward thinking into something that does not even exist yet, will be so forward thinking into something that does not even exist yet, ie a husband or a good man. They've already have these things lined up in these. Okay, I want a good man. He's going to be making this amount of money and he's going to be doing these things. So the question really stems from that communication to that person that you are feeling that way about. For men, I would definitely agree. I would definitely agree that men are more prone to wait till that feeling is there and in front of them, whether it be good or bad it could be. You know what? I am the type of man that is willing to, to put it all on the line for a particular person. But you ain't that person, right? You know and and and in that and in that space, he should definitely communicate that when he does have that thought process that, hey, this is not going to work for me because I am in a different space and I know what your expectations are. But I think it's good to talk about those things, especially from for the women who do think so far ahead of what they want and what they expect. So I would agree 100 percent. You know you can't really speak to those things yet because it's not necessarily that scenario. The scenario hasn't presented itself yet, it's not there.
Speaker 1:For the man to look and say, hey, yeah, I'm this type of guy, nah, I'm really not choosing you, then the woman will hold those things against you as if you lied. It's not that he lied, he just it's just, those things aren't for you. You know he changed his mind. And the same thing for women. You know it doesn't necessarily have to be a man changing his mind. A woman has that same right to change her mind as her mind as well.
Speaker 1:So I just found it interesting and wanted to know do you think women and that goes into the next question Do you think women are more prone to do that and have that vision? Way before you know, soon before you, even you know, you may just meet the man and you already have you know, I want him to be this way, I want him to be that way, I want him to do all of these things. And what I'm saying is that if you communicate that he is going to run or he going to stay, and if he stays it's because he's he's probably checked off most of the boxes that you have. He's probably not going to check them all, but he's probably can handle the things that you check off. So I just thought that was that was kind of interesting. Do you think women are more prone to have this vision, this?
Speaker 2:this vision of expectations like we're talking about Absolutely. I think you know um, as, as you know children, you know most most. You know girls are taught to. You know sort of you play with Barbie dolls or you know your Ken doll or your baby dolls or whatever, but you know you're. You know girls are taught to. You know sort of you play with Barbie dolls or you know your Ken doll or your baby dolls or whatever, but you know you're. You're playing house. You know what I'm saying. Like you're preparing to be. You know a wife you're looking for.
Speaker 2:You know the knight in shining armor or whatever it may be versus. You know, you guys y'all have like GI Joe and y'all tearing up stuff, so y'all not thinking about being no husband.
Speaker 1:It wasn't no toys about being no husband Right.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I think you know definitely women. You know that's the you know most of us, that's how we're raised. You know to be somebody's wife or to be with someone, and I think that's also, too, where you have a lot of you know women now that are sort of you know buck. You have a lot of you know, um, women now that are sort of you know bucking the system, like no, I don't need a man to complete me. You know what I mean. I can, I can do it on my own type deal, but, um, yeah, I do think women are more likely to be on this. Okay, if I'm spending my time with him, this is going to be long-term and you know, and if it's going to be long-term, that I need this, this, this, this, this I need these things right.
Speaker 2:Mm-hmm yeah.
Speaker 1:Makes sense.
Speaker 3:You got something, though. Yeah, I think what's even better maybe to converse about or to represent is to say I can be these things, but it's up to you to figure out if I can be that for you. Right, there you go. So for like a, and I'm a speak for women on a woman's side. Right, if a woman lays out for a guy.
Speaker 3:You know, this is the kind of wife I can be. This is, this is how I take care of a man. This is how I can take care of a man, for when a guy hears that, he's thinking he's that man. So I think that first conversation would be these are all the things I could be. This is the woman I could be, but it's up to you to show me whether or not I can be that woman for you. You know what I'm saying, and I think that's fair for a man to do as well. This is the kind of man I am. This is the kind of man I can be for the woman that I'm into, but it's up to you to show me whether or not that is the kind of man that can be with you. So having that general conversation of who I am to everybody I meet the first time gives the assumption that that's who you're about to get and that's not the truth.
Speaker 1:Right Because it puts the person in an accountability phase Right. Because, you got to earn it Right. It lets you know that those things can only happen if I I'm accountable for my actions and I'm consistent, right, yeah?
Speaker 2:can I ask you guys a question?
Speaker 2:of course go ahead do you think that you know, going along the lines of what you said then, do you think that women are more willing to be like well, you know what he says. You know this is the type of woman that he wants, so I'm going to become you know all of that for him, because I really want to be with this person. Or do you feel that you know, men are the ones that are like I really want to be with this woman so I'm willing to bend my personal opinion? I think women bend more than men, do you?
Speaker 2:know what I mean, they're willing to sacrifice more or settle more than men Like y'all are. Just like. You know what, this ain't the one I'm moving on. You know what I mean. So that's that's my opinion, but I want to hear what you guys think.
Speaker 1:I would say a woman will be is more definitely more prone to change who she is. All together for a man that she truly believes in and is in love with. She will, if she will compromise her herself, and that that's that's what relationships are. Right, it is compromise, but I do think men do it, I think women do it in general and in relationships, I think men do it in marriage. I think men would. I think when marriage comes, I think a man will compromise itself more because of the expectations of marriage, and that's a whole nother topic, right, that's a whole nother thing. But I just think in marriage those things happen. I would say more consistent for men. But I think, yeah, I would agree that through my experience and what I've seen, I've seen women, um, really change who they are.
Speaker 1:But at the same time, I you know, when you're talking about today's society and where we are today, a lot of that is being kind of thrown out the window. You know that that concept of even compromising at all. But I do think a woman will change everything. But the thing is that it's very hard for a woman to get to that point nowadays. You know they are so skeptical of the man on every level. It's a you have to, like you said, said you have to prove yourself to me from day one, and if we're in that mind state at the beginning, that would mean the man would have to prove a lot before you start changing who you are as a woman. But I'll let you go ahead and take it. I'll let you go ahead and take it. I want to hear what Dove got to say. Go ahead and take it.
Speaker 3:I'll let you go ahead and take it. I want to hear what dove guys say. So I think. I think both men and women do that when they are, when they have a high level of respect and love for each other, right. So I think men and women can compromise almost equally because from a man's side and something we have talked about, treyrey is that saying of happy wife, happy life Right. You know what I'm saying, meaning that you compromise whatever you have to compromise to keep your woman happy. And I would say, for the most part, throughout history, men have done that when they're at the level, like you said, trey, in a marriage or you're at that relationship level with the woman that you're with, and traditionally women have always done that too. Right.
Speaker 3:To answer the maybe the first or second part of that question, I think it depends on the generation. I think older, older generations go into relationships more open minded, understanding that they may have to compromise a few things for it to work. I think newer generations feel like I don't have to compromise a damn thing. You're going to take me for who I am and you're going to take it or you're going to leave it, but I'm not changing anything. You need to check all my boxes. This is who I am. I get an attitude, I do this, I go out. You're going to have to accept me just how I am, or this ain't happening. So, honestly, I think it's a generation thing, for both men and women.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:I agree with that as well, okay.
Speaker 1:So where do you think men and women get the standards or roles that they use to judge each other on how well they are doing in a relationship?
Speaker 2:I think, obviously with most women, women it's gonna come from their friends, um how well they're doing um I don't know with with men. Um, I'm trying to think. You know I was funny answering questions for me and watch it watch what? You say watch what you say, I know right you heard, look you.
Speaker 3:You heard how she giggled when I said I'm going to speak for women. When I asked that one question she giggled like yeah, here he go, Right Right.
Speaker 1:Watch your mouth, you did good, I don't know.
Speaker 2:I would hope that you know with with men they have some other male figure in their life that you know kind of told them whether or not they were doing well For my brothers. You know, even my grandfather it was you know my brothers, it was my mom With my grandfather. You know it was, you know his wife and you know my grandmother and his mom like it was always a female also that kind of said you know, if you're a man, you need to do this, and that you know what I mean. Um, but yeah, I would hope to think it would be another male that they looked up to. I think it should be anyway.
Speaker 1:So would you say that your biggest influence on love and relationships came from your grandparents?
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 3:Okay, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, reminds me they were married for 50 years before they passed. So, yeah, definitely they were the most consistent relationship that I saw. So, yeah, definitely a lot of my views came from them.
Speaker 1:And another. You alluded to your friends, right, women's friends, that validation from friends. Um, why do you think that is? Why do you think women are, but from both ends, whether it's the friend or the woman who is being evaluated, or valid or validated.
Speaker 1:Why do you think that is so prevalent in our relationships today and in society, when it comes to what women view as important in the relationship? Because it really has nothing to do with the man, it has nothing to do with the man, it has nothing to do with the relationship and with the man. But somehow this has always been a barrier, an element, a topic, an issue, and a lot of times there are people, there are men, that have no clue that that, that influence or or those, those things that we're talking about are even even being discussed. So he, he's, he's already at a loss, he's already at a disadvantage. Um, so why do you think that is that is so important for women to have these influential relationships into their friends' relationship? If you, if you could, if you could understand what I mean when I say that.
Speaker 2:You know, I think you know we as women. You know we love sisterhood. You know, you know I think about like. You know, when you see movies and you see women at the barbershop and everybody's just talking about what's going on with everybody, you know what I mean. Or you have, like just your circle of friends and people that you confide in, and you know you tell them everything about your life, even things that you know you feel like your spouse wouldn't be interested in knowing, or you wouldn't feel comfortable saying it to them. So I think that's just part of our nature to to sort of want to have someone that we talk to and confide in.
Speaker 2:I do think, though, when it comes to relationships, unfortunately, that that's one of the areas where you know we as females, I honestly think that you know you have to be really careful about what you say to your friends or even a family members.
Speaker 2:You know, in that case, just because you know you're giving them your perspective on a situation, or the way that you're evaluating that person or whatever, and let's say it's a negative perspective you know your family, your friends, they're never going to forget that you may forgive the person, you move on, but then they still have in the back of their mind what you told them about this person.
Speaker 2:I can also say and you know, I know my ladies are gonna be mad at me but you also have some friends that are jealous. You know what I mean. And so those are the friends that you can't really say things to because they're always going to hate on your relationship, because you know really say things too, because they're always going to hate on your relationship because you know they don't want I don't want to say that they don't want to see you happy. It's just that you know they have their own issues that they're dealing with and so they can't see you happy. It's not that they don't necessarily want to. It's whatever's going on with them. I just personally think you know, unless you got like that, that one really close friend that you know, that's that's not really judgmental, that can be unbiased, that can really give you like some solid, good advice my recommendation is really not to talk to your friends Just because, I mean, we're grown women some things we just got to figure out on our own.
Speaker 2:you know what I'm saying and everybody's relationship is going to be different, you know. And then you know again, my lady's going to be mad at me. You also got some. Would hope that you're communicating with the person that you're with. That's really who you should be talking to. Real talk, right, but you know, like I said, a lady's going to kill me for saying that, but it's the truth.
Speaker 1:You can't tell everybody what's going on with you. No, you was being honest with that.
Speaker 3:Do you think there's a need to be validated and correct? That plays a part into, maybe, why women confide in their girlfriends, and maybe men do it too. I say that from a perspective of when people tell a story, they're always the victim of the situation. Nobody really goes into a story and they really say what they did to play a part in whatever's going on goes into a story and they really say what they did to play a part in whatever's going on, right? So I'm thinking that a lot of that may have to do with the person needing validation and being correct, right, like the way I'm thinking is right and and the way I'm seeing the situation is correct. It may not be truthful, right. They may, you know, somehow forget some pieces that they, the roles they played in the situation.
Speaker 3:But you know, maybe there's this need to be correct and validated, that the way they think and the way they're feeling, um, is the right path. Uh, and men do that too, you know. That's just not a one thing, yeah, and I'm wondering if that's, if that's a piece of it, I don't know.
Speaker 2:Maybe you know what I mean, Like I could see. I mean, I can think of a time when I had to make a really big decision about a relationship and I did, you know, go to a friend that I trusted and said, you know, hey, you know, tell me, you know, what do you think about this? You know, if you were in the same position, how would you handle it, type of thing. So maybe sometimes it's validation, maybe, but I do think again that you know it goes back to what you said about maturity. You know what I mean. If you're mature enough and you hold yourself accountable for your decisions, then you have to make that decision, so that if it's right or wrong, it's on you. You know what I mean. I never want a friend to come to me and be like, well, you told me to leave him and you don't and now blah, blah, blah.
Speaker 1:You know what I'm saying, like uh-uh, no, no sis.
Speaker 3:I'm not going to tell you to leave your man. You know what I mean. It's got to be your decision.
Speaker 1:You know, what I'm saying. I don't want you on the bed cold, well yeah you just hit on a another element of this making decisions.
Speaker 1:You know, it's really, it's really that simple. Sometimes a lot of people I'm not going to say just women, but women and men but I would say, if a woman is is unclear about a man, for whatever reason, she may go to her friend to help her make that decision, whether it be a good or bad decision or a decision on how she should respond to that man, because she doesn't want to make that tough decision and she needs somebody there to help her make that decision. I just don't like the fact that they seem to understand the man. Those friends seem to understand men so well and are men experts. And it just baffles me that you hear about these stories or these things and it's just like, for example, you always hear a woman say, oh girl, he not, he's no good for you, he ain't no good for you, that's not for you. You know what I'm saying. And then, and then years later, you see, you see them together.
Speaker 3:You see them two together, yeah yeah, but I feel like.
Speaker 2:You know, guys, y'all do that sometimes too. You know you have your friends that'll be like. You know she for the street. So you know, don't, just don't fall in love with her, blah, blah, blah. You know, I mean I think it works.
Speaker 3:It works both ways yeah, it does, because I tell you what guys do. What guys tend to do is they'll definitely find the man to give them the response. So they know that they want to hear Right. So if, if, if a guy's about playing games and he's about doing whatever dirt he doing, he's going to confide in the friend that he has that also agrees with what he's doing. He's not going to confide in the friend that he knows is going to give him a different perspective or answer, unless he's actually trying to fix something or change. So when men do that, men are very careful with who they confide in about their relationships and their choices, because they don't want the advice from the guy that they know is living a different lifestyle than they choose to live.
Speaker 1:Right. I would agree with that I would agree with that because it's about accountability right, unless he's trying to change.
Speaker 3:If he's trying to change his ways, then he'll probably go to that, to that friend or that person he may look up to. You know what I? I like the way this guy's handling his business with his relationships maybe his wife or whatever. Let me ask him about what I just did and see how to change this or where I messed up and how to fix it. But if he all about playing games, he's not going to talk to that dude who is trying to be faithful, trying to do things right. He's going to go find a guy who's for the streets too, and that's who he's going to get his advice from, because they're going to think the same, yeah.
Speaker 1:I definitely know some people like that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's what guys do yeah, and then also experience.
Speaker 1:You know just experience. You know people from, for men and women, you know, from a man's perspective, for me it's really, it's really about the experience someone, someone has to have an experience that I'm going through, that I haven't that, I haven't that I haven't spoken to about, and to get that advice on how they got through that particular experience. You know, that's so I can learn and not necessarily take, not necessarily take the same route, but find out the pros and cons of what happened when that person, when that man made the decisions that he made. And then I can apply whatever things that may be valuable to me to make my decision. But experience is key, I mean.
Speaker 1:But I find it that a lot of us in these relationships are being advised by people who just are not qualified on no level, mentally or physically. They just not qualified to advise you, not qualified to advise you, um. So you know, definitely pay attention to um, you know who you putting your information out to, because a lot of times that that energy will come back and and put you in a worse situation than you than you already in, because you know you follow somebody. You know the blind leading the blind kind of thing. So you know, yeah, I just just thought that was interesting, you know very much, so OK, yeah.
Speaker 3:So next question what do you think men need the most from women, most from women, and what do you think women need the most from men?
Speaker 2:Ooh, I think men need respect. Or I feel, like you know, men need to feel like they have what it takes. You know what I mean. So men need affirmation, they need respect, that sort of thing. They need respect, that sort of thing. I think, women, we need security, like you know, to feel like you know we're worth fighting for, we're special. Yeah, that's, that's, that's my opinion.
Speaker 3:OK, and what do you think?
Speaker 2:is missing Because those.
Speaker 3:Those seem to be very simple things in theory Right To, to, to respect someone and to protect someone seem very simple in theory. Why do you think that mark is being missed?
Speaker 2:I think that you know it just depends on, like you know, your different definitions of respect or different perspectives like your.
Speaker 2:You know your different definitions of respect or different perspectives, like, for example, one thing I think that you know women are big one is, you know, feeling. You know good, special feeling, love, that sort of thing, and so because we, you know that's what makes us feel good, and sometimes we think, well, that's all y'all need. We just need to tell y'all we love you all the time. Just you know, give you all these feelings Whereas it's y'all we love you all the time. Just you know, give you all these feelings whereas it's y'all. You know again, I feel so bad talking about y'all. Y'all are not really into the feelings like that. It's more of, I think, men feel like I'd rather you respect me more than you love me, because respect is more than the feelings. It's you know. Again, you know if, if I'm in your presence, you know I'm giving you my full attention. You know I'm not telling my friends about, you know, personal things that need to go on between us. I'm not embarrassing you or disrespecting you in the public by either the way that I'm talking to you or you know I'm flirting with another man or whatever. I think it goes along with you. Know just your definition. It goes along with you. Know just your definition.
Speaker 2:Whereas a female could look at respect as well. If I come home every day or I cook for you every day, I'm showing you that I respect you, yeah, but then you know you could be talking, talking to me any kind of way too. That's not respect. So I just think it can just be. We look at the terms differently. Same thing with, you know, feeling safe. A man can feel like, well, I may be flirted with this woman, or I had an inappropriate conversation, but I didn't actually sleep with her, so I am making you feel special.
Speaker 2:You are safe you know what I mean Because I didn't. You know, emotionally safe. You're safe because I didn't go all the way. But that emotional affair can be sometimes more hurtful than the physical affair. So I just think it's the way, but that emotional affair can be sometimes more hurtful than the physical affair. So I just think it's the way that we look at the terms. Maybe sometimes we look at it two different ways, and again that goes back to that communication. How can I respect you? What do you need from me for you to feel respected or for you to know that I think you're more than enough for me, and then, vice versa, I would like my, would like them. You know, my man asked me what do I need to do to make you feel safe or to make you feel supported?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I definitely would agree that respect is is a major, and then for a lot of men that equates to love. You know that respect, so I definitely would agree 100%.
Speaker 3:Yeah so.
Speaker 2:I definitely would agree 100 percent.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's something you said about the communication piece is that I've had experiences and I've seen experiences where people think they're doing enough and to hear that what you're doing for me isn't what I need, even though you think you're doing a bang up job. So, like the example you gave, a person's coming home, they're cooking meals, they're doing this and doing that and the person they're with may not need that from them. That's a challenging conversation for people to have to say listen, you're not hitting the mark. And then the other person going is well, I am hitting the mark because I'm doing one, two, three, four, five. And then I have the conversation to say, well, technically I don't really need you to do one, two and three, I need you to do seven, eight, nine, right, like you want something different from them.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't think that should be a hard conversation, though. You know what I mean. Like I get what you're saying, but I feel like if I love you and I want it to work, then I'm going to say to you you know, look, you know, baby, I appreciate you doing X, y and Z, but honestly, what I need is this so can you, you know, if you take effort away from doing that and do this instead, that'll be what really makes me happy. And then what do I need to do for you in exchange? You know what I mean. So it's about I'm asking you to do something for me, but I'm willing to do something for you too, because I'd rather have that conversation than I'm starting to resent you or my feelings are starting to change because I'm not getting what I want.
Speaker 2:And I know sometimes we as women, we can do a bad job of sometimes catching an attitude or thinking you're supposed to figure out that something's not right and I'm kind of like, no, let me just cut to the chase. I'm just going to say, look, I don't feel good about this and this is why I don't feel good about this, and what can we do to change that? What do you need from me, but it has to be a, not just a. You need to change, you need to change. It needs to be. Can you do this for me, but then I'm also willing to do something for you. So you see that again. That's that 100, 100, like you're doing something, I'm doing something. We're both in this versus again letting that bitterness build up or that separation starts to happen because someone feels like their needs are not being met.
Speaker 1:Makes sense. Those are great answers, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, she passed the test. She passed with a 70. You got it.
Speaker 3:You passed it 70 is passing.
Speaker 1:That's barely 69. A hard C we just messed up.
Speaker 3:He said a hard C. You know that difficult c can mean more than that easy a you know I'm saying no, no no every day.
Speaker 1:Your honesty is definitely valued, so I definitely appreciate it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, um I appreciate that next question I got for you and this is something that we've asked on some of our other love and hate uh series for you what is it about men that you appreciate the most?
Speaker 2:um, probably your strength, your um, resilience, um, probably strength and resilience really really sort of sums it up and and not just like physical strength, obviously I, I appreciate that, but you know also, you know I I can't say I'd ever want to walk in the shoes of a, of a black man especially. You know what, what you guys have to deal with, the stereotypes, not just from you know the workplace, but then even, quite honestly, how other men look at you, how women look at you, even how other races sometimes view you. It takes a lot of strength, I believe, to be a black man, especially a black man of character. And then, with that being said, resilience you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Like a lot of times, more times than not, you guys make a lot of sacrifices because you know this is going to impact my family or this is going to impact my brand. You know, because a lot of you guys got a lot of businesses and things going on it used to be back in the day. You know this is going to impact my family's reputation. So there's a lot of things that you guys then take, you know, because you're like I just have to bounce back, or I got other people depending on me, or I got to be a role model. You know I got to set the example, so definitely. You know just your strength and resilience I think I appreciate the most.
Speaker 3:And for the fellas that's listening what do you think are some things that you would want men to start appreciating more in women?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I think that sometimes men can misinterpret women that come across as being really strong. And it's not that women don't need men or they want men to feel. Like the way society is now, women have had to play stronger roles and so, instead of not necessarily being intimidated by it or judging women by it, sort of start to appreciate women that can be, you know, that can be strong if they need to be. Women are we're all different. We're all beautiful in our own ways. Women are we're all different, we're all beautiful in our own ways. So I think men should appreciate, you know, the different elements of beauty that that women have, whether it's you know, they choose to be natural, or you know even the women that you know, feel like they need a little help.
Speaker 2:Appreciate them for that. You know what I'm saying, because nine times out of 10, they did it because they thought, you know, making y'all happy, real talk. But, you know, appreciate them for their beauty, appreciate them, that you know women can wear different styles and do all kinds of stuff. You know what I mean. We're very we can adapt quickly, so appreciate that about women, yeah, okay.
Speaker 3:I'm trying to make it even two things apiece. It's your answer. You could be as even and uneven as you want to be.
Speaker 1:Absolutely Unconditional love. Do you think? Who do you?
Speaker 2:think displays unconditional love more men or women, you know what. So my initial response, or I feel like the right response, is to say women. Right, because it's easier for us, um, because, again, we were just raised to be loving, you know loving wives, and then you know, you, we actually are the ones that, um, give birth to children, so it's easier for us to sort of feel loved. But I will say again, like seeing my brothers, seeing my grandfather, even my father, the way that I've seen them love and be vulnerable at times, I don't know, it's gosh. I've seen men do it, so I don't want to say it's all women, I think.
Speaker 1:I think men can display unconditional love too you know, those men in your life display unconditional love, you know, because a lot of people, a lot of people in today's society haven't haven't really seen that, and if they have, they're not vocal about it.
Speaker 2:So that's, that's really refreshing to hear yeah, well, you know, I think nowadays too, a lot of people really don't want to um embrace love. You know what I mean, and you know not to really get religious, but you know, down in the south bible belt, you know what I mean, and not to really get religious, but down in South Bible Belt, all we do is talk about God. God is love. Why wouldn't you wanna display love? But I do think that love is a beautiful thing. You know what I mean. Like it's when you can be the most vulnerable and recognize a person isn't perfect, you know. So you love them, even for their. You know. You love them for where they are and for who they are, flaws and all, and then they can see you the same way.
Speaker 2:I feel, like in life, like so many people, like you know, they can put on these facades or these acts or, you know, try to put on this tough face. But when you love somebody, you shouldn't have to do that. You should just be able to be you without being judged and knowing that they're going to appreciate every part of you, just the way you are. You know what I'm saying and also wanting the best for you. So, yeah, I think love is a beautiful thing. I think so many people have been hurt based on past trauma or relationships or whatever, and so people are afraid of love. But I think I think love is awesome in high school.
Speaker 3:You know I'm not going to date anyone you know or whatever, but I'll just say, back when I was in high school, love started to be a thing where at least men was was kind of skeptical of saying to around other guys. It was like you love her but you like what are you talking about? Man? But that's that. That comes from an immaturity thing, as I said high school right, and I say that because, moving forward to today, I feel like grown men are starting to even starting to think like that way, like love is this toxic thing you should be afraid of because it will hurt you. Right, a lot of people are, like you just said, are just scared to be in love with someone because they are scared of the pain that could be associated with being that vulnerable to someone.
Speaker 3:And something that I can say that I have seen in some way shape or form is I feel like there are some parents who are raising their children in a way to sort of make them not vulnerable to falling in love with someone, like they harden them to the point where it's like I've been through something.
Speaker 3:I don't want you to go through it. So I'm going to kind of instill these values in you and these characteristics I'm going to point out and build on so that you aren't this vulnerable person, so that you don't love so easily because I love someone and it hurt and I don't want you to go through that Right. So I don't even think as a society that we're even doing a good job of teaching our children and the younger generations of how awesome love is and how good of a thing it is, and I think that goes back to something you also said is about connecting love to God and that religious piece. You know what I'm saying. So everything you said I agree with and I think a lot of those things on all different levels is what's missing. It's what's causing that fear and causing the anxiety and the questioning of, of, of that word.
Speaker 1:Yeah, those stereotypes, um, and a lot of that is in our culture and a lot of different ways when it comes to, you know, uh, upbringing that time, those nineties where we are today, the definition of what manhood looks like, those stereotypes of what a man is, you know, some of those things probably. I don't think love is even on the top 10 of that list, um, and it probably will be. You know, sacrifice, selfless courage, security, financial stability, consistency, but I would definitely say love needs to be, you know, somewhere at the top. Um, so, um, yeah, that's, yeah, that's, that's very, uh, that's very interesting, good point I think love is there because love drives those things right.
Speaker 3:I mean right. So I think I think that list is love, so I don't think it should be right in the list. I think that drives. I think that drives the list to.
Speaker 1:I think I think it should. I think it should drive the list, but vengeance is real, anger, anger and vengeance is real and it could drive you to have some of those things that are on the list is everlasting if it comes. If you add that to that list, if you have that behind that list, it doesn't matter what happens to you. Because of that love, you will be able to still go forward in those other aspects. If something else is driving you, I think it's temporary, it's a temporary feeling, it's a temporary thing.
Speaker 1:Um, because, though, because you have, you have to love yourself in order to be able to achieve those things on that list, and and if you have, you have to love yourself in order to to be able to achieve those things on that list, and and if you and if you love yourself, those things will remain prevalent in your life until you you're no longer breathing that pain and that anger and that vengeance is a is a. It's a temporary thing. It's not going to. It's not going to allow you to, it's not going to allow you to have positive outcomes on those things that we list, on what a real man could be. You're going to fall short on something on that list.
Speaker 3:So love keeps that list consistent.
Speaker 1:Yes, I would say so. Yeah, I agree with that. Yeah, because if we're talking about a particular thing and I'm not angry about this thing, but this other topic that I'm angry about, it was pushing me to stay consistent because I want to show this person over here, because I don't like this person over here, I'm going to show up every day and be consistent and be intentionally consistent to confront this person, but then when you give me this other opportunity on the right, I'm tardy, I'm never there, I'm not, I'm not even involved or I'm not doing anything that resembles this thing that I'm doing on the left.
Speaker 3:So that's because anger is driving what's on the left. That's right. Yeah, great point. Yeah, well, and I know before we chatted about, uh, you know, the breadwinner and kind of how that plays a role in relationships, as some you know. In some kind of way, if a woman is a breadwinner, does that change the dynamics of the relationship?
Speaker 2:I think it depends on the woman, quite honestly, and what they value. There are some people that value material things, or their worth is tied into their income or what they have. So if that is the mindset of the woman and she is the breadwinner, then definitely it's going to change the dynamics of the relationship. Because you know, now she feels worthy or, you know, feels like she's the stronger person in a relationship. So then along with that could come the lack of respect for the man. You know, because she's the breadwinner, or she feels like she's the one that can be the decision maker or you know she can do what she wants to do. Really, you know she doesn't have to extend that courtesy of saying this weekend I'm going out of town with my girls because you know I make the money, it's my money, you know what I mean. I'm handling business, I can do what I want to do. So I know there are some women like that. It could change the dynamics of the relationship. But then you know, I do feel like there are other women where it doesn't matter.
Speaker 2:I've been in relationships before where I was the red winner, but I still felt like I loved the person that I was with. I respected the person I was with. They're still trying. It's not like they weren't employed. I was just in a better position than they were, and so that didn't necessarily change the dynamics of the relationship. We went out sometimes. I still let them pay, you know. I mean I'm not going to pay all the time just because I make the most money. I would still let you pay sometimes, but I'm still going to do stuff too. You know what I mean. I'm not going to always think. You know I didn't think it was always his responsibility, especially when I knew I made more. So I don't think it should change the dynamic of the relationship. It just depends on the person. Quite honestly.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so for the first woman, right? The woman who you were saying and I'm a paraphrase kind of gets on a power trip because she makes the most money, right? In your opinion? Why would that woman seek a man that makes less money than her if she's going to approach her relationship in such a negative space, right, with that type of energy, like I'm running the show? You think she finds that man on purpose, that she chooses a man that makes less money than her on purpose to maintain that strength, versus finding a man who makes more than her and possibly feeling like she's challenged similar to how society believes men feel about being with women who make more money, like we feel like we're losing something or we have to give up a piece of our quote, unquote dominance in the relationship, right? Why do you think she chooses that man?
Speaker 2:You know, I think you know it depends. It could be, you know, maybe they started off and he did make more money and then life changed and you know she started to make more money. So maybe that wasn't her choice. That's just how it happened. But I do know some females where you know they want to be the one. You know they got to be a boss.
Speaker 1:You know what I'm saying, and so they want to be in that position where they feel like a man can't tell them what to do. You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:The man is basically there, you know, for when they need them physically. You know what I'm saying. So I know females like that too, you know. I just again, it depends on the person and what your intention is and being in that relationship. If you're looking for something long-term, if you're looking for love, you know, then the amount of money that you make or he makes shouldn't determine who's dominant and who runs the relationship. You know, I think everybody should. Ooh, I almost said something. My sister's going to get me.
Speaker 1:I should say everybody play their role.
Speaker 2:People just need you know whatever whatever, whatever your relationship dynamic is, because that works for you guys, it shouldn't change based on who makes the most money.
Speaker 3:And this conversation is good because not too long ago I made a point or gave a perspective about this alpha male thing and how that word is attached to income.
Speaker 3:That word is attached to income where if a man is having a conversation with a woman or a group of women, he calls himself an alpha male and then he disposes of how much money he makes. And let's say he makes $25,000 a year. Right? My interpretation is they were probably laughing his face and say, bro, you're not an alpha male if you're only making $25,000 a year. His face and say, bro, you're not an alpha male and if you're only making $25,000 a year, versus a guy saying I'm an alpha male and I make $400,000 a year, when the reality is that term doesn't even have anything to do with money, right? So it's so interesting how many things we attach to money when it comes to dealing with each other on a personal people level and how much we allow money and income to influence who we are and how we treat each other. I just find that fascinating how that, how that weaves into pieces of fabric within the relationships you know in our communities. You know it's just and sometimes it's unconscious.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think it has a lot to do with it's unconscious, and that concept of money equals power and respect and a lot of other things, and you find people not confronting certain issues or not addressing certain issues because that person makes four hundred thousand dollars a year or whatever. They and that person may not even know who he or she is as an individual. They may be a real personal struggle with themselves. They just they just very successful in the business world. Um, so yeah, I mean, it's, it's uh, it's interesting, but yeah, money, money will give you a title that you may not even be deserving of.
Speaker 2:You know, it makes me think of. Well, I say Kanye, the, you know, same Kanye, like the first album. You remember the song it All Falls Down. He's talking about, you know, because we're not used to having nothing, that when we do have now we're going to be flashy with it. You know we're going to go out and do all these things, buy these expensive cars.
Speaker 2:You know we're going to go out and do all these things, buy these expensive cars, and I think you know some of that kind of like what you were saying, trey. It does have to do with our identity and how we see ourselves, and so we equate then money to our work and I feel like money comes and goes, and so if that's your work or that's all that matters to you, then you know that's that's. That's a sad position to be in. You know. Same thing with relationships. If you feel like you know your, your spouse or you know whoever you're dating, isn't you know making enough money at that time, that doesn't mean that you know they might not come up later on. You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Things could change. Y'all can go into business together. Like you, you never know. I never feel like money should be the reason why you know someone sort of considers themselves to be, you know, a high value person or, like you guys said, an alpha male, what we're seeing here recently. You know you got people with money that have integrity issues and you know they're having. You know I won't say any names, y'all know who out there, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1:So money.
Speaker 2:money isn't doesn't make you an alpha male at all. If you got all these other issues going on, it's just more money for you to make bad decisions with you know. More money, more problems. Y'all asked me about women looking for men. You know they want to be the dominant person or whatever. What about you guys? Do y'all try to look for women where you know you feel like you you're the breadwinner, so then you kind of run things? Do you think guys tend to try to find women that are not on the same level that they're on?
Speaker 3:I think some men purposely would have a problem dating or being with a woman who makes more money than him. That's a fact. There are a good amount of men out there who don't know how to handle that situation because they do assume, because they make the most money, that that means that they are in control quote unquote of their relationship Right, like what they say goes because they make the most money. And generally those type of men don't value or look for women who make more money than them. That's a fact. Now what I say men look for that based on money I don't think so Like completely. I think say men look for that based on money, I don't think so completely.
Speaker 3:I think what men look for the most is where she is mentally right. So if a man is playing games, he's going to look for the woman mentally that he can play games with. If he's looking for a woman to be his wife, possibly his mother of his children, he's looking for a woman who is mentally can meet that that level. Because throughout history I would say that men have kind of always played the role as being the provider in some way shape or form. So I don't think that's new for me it's not new for us to take that role, because that's something we've been taught since day one is you are the provider, so that's something I think becomes natural for us. Um, what we do with that is just based on pretty much where we are in life. What are we looking for? Are we playing games, or are we ready to be with a, you know, a mature woman who wants to go somewhere and wants to grow and wants to build?
Speaker 1:I. I would definitely agree with you, dub, when it comes to when you're talking about an intellectual man who has, has, has experience and who really knows who he is. Most men initially don't care about none of that. They just they want a woman that they're attracted to and is beautiful. They may find out later on that she isn't mentally healthy or she may have some mental issues or she may have some financial trouble, but I think that's how men get into the predicaments that they get into. That's how they end up. That's how these men in general end up in situations. Because at some point Men in general end up in situations, because at some point we did not do the work and I think we all have been there at some point, men in general we have not done the work to really think about what we are looking for.
Speaker 1:I think there's a, there's an animalistic nature about us that we initially start off with and only the intellectual men who can identify that and pivot away from that and start having real conversations about let me find out who this person is, let me find out who she really is. What kind of characteristics do we align? Do we have the same goals where most men, a lot of men stay stuck in that phase. They may talk and walk like they're not, but they are actually stuck in the first phase of when they met that woman. It could be a year later, it could be 10 years later, right, they are still stuck in the phase one of not the phase one of the relationship, that phase of a man and his anatomy and his physicality of just wanting to produce, have sex. It's a physical thing and and that's just it, until you become a little more wiser and you start learning from your mistakes. Now you understand, when you meet a woman at the bar, that you should be having a little bit more deeper conversation versus what you're doing later on. You know, maybe some child support bills later, some kids, a few three, four later, some baby mamas, some slash tires. Now, now you, you come into the table a little bit different, you know.
Speaker 1:I do think that what Dove said is is definitely on point. I just think there's one piece that a lot of men struggle with and that's a maturity thing for men uh, overcoming that physical, and some never, never overcome it, but you need to at least acknowledge it, you need to at least know that it's there. If you know it's there, then you can. Then you can work through that and really get to the substance of meeting someone and being in a relationship with somebody. But a lot of men just deny it even exists and that's why they end up with all kinds of situations.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I also think men as a whole. We have to do a better job of realizing our value outside of our pockets. You know, even in society where we have a number of women that judge men by how much money they make, and that's what they, that's what those particular kind of women place men in certain categories. What we have to do is not listen to that and learn more about ourselves and say this is the kind of person I am and this is what I bring to a relationship outside of money, because those relationships don't work very well.
Speaker 3:If the only reason you're going to respect me is because I make more money than you, or the only reason you're going to not go out when I ask you not to go out is because I make more money than you, or I come home to a hot meal because I make more money than you, if that's my expectation as to why you are the woman you are to me, then that says to me that I don't know how to be the man for you, because I'm not being one, because I'm basing everything that you're doing for me off of the money I make and, like you said, I could lose my job tomorrow, I mean or whatever it is right.
Speaker 3:My income can change and and the challenge that kind of man will have is, in that situation, if his, if his income changes, he is not going to know how to value him, value himself, and he's going to fuck up their relationship. Because you could still keep being the same woman, you could still keep cooking his meals, giving him the respect, all the things you were doing when he was making all the money. But the moment he loses that, he doesn't know how to respect himself anymore and he's just going to, he's going to destroy the relationship and it won't be anything you've done we have to do a better job of realizing who we are, what we are, and step outside of that box of you know what the numbers in the bank account look like.
Speaker 1:That's right, believe it or not, you look like an idiot as soon as you open your mouth. If you don't really look in the mirror and be accountable, I'm just, I'm just letting you know. When you come out and you say things, it just doesn't add up. It doesn't add up and you know. Just have an accountability of your own mental and your own mental health and your characteristics. You should, you should be. If you have the resources to, you have the money and the resources to get to put the work into yourself, why not do that? You know what I mean. So, yeah, great question what else you got?
Speaker 2:um, I think that was it honestly. That's, that's probably it for now great conversation.
Speaker 1:I really enjoyed it. I really enjoyed your answers and your perspective.
Speaker 2:Thank you, I appreciate you guys having me on here being able to share my perspective.
Speaker 3:It's all good, we out, we out.
Speaker 2:Thanks.
